William Branham Goes Overseas: What Happens in India

Hello and welcome to another episode of the William Branham Historical Research Podcast. I'm your host, John Collins, the author and founder of William Branham Historical Research at William-Branham.org and with me I have my co-host, researcher, minister, and friend Charles Paisley, the founder of christiangospelchurch.org. And together we're examining the history and the intersections in history between William Branham and other key figures that either influenced or were influenced by the post-World War II healing revivals. Charles I have literally been just waiting and aching for this day to come. We've been waiting since the last episode we recorded and

as I mentioned last time it was just so incredibly fun to talk about the different versions of people. You know what I mean? You've got the William Branham, the Zon stage, the William Branham, this off stage and we were building up to this moment that I'm hoping that we get through it today in today's podcast but we were talking about you know the people that traveled with William Branham and we revered these people as though they were disciples and apostles of the Bible and you know it's I heard one minister say that we're living in the second book of Acts and that William

Branham was the forerunner of the second book of Acts and so the view that we hold of these men and everyone in the message who was in William Branham's inner circle knew that this just wasn't the case so I'm just very excited to get into today. Yeah I'm excited too because of what we're going to talk about today we're continuing on with William Branham's overseas tours and today we're going to get certainly his I think his most famous tour his tour to South Africa and to Zimbabwe and then also his if we have time I sure hope we get there we're going to work our way through his

third tour which was to Europe and then finally into India where yeah there's some really interesting stories John that we know coming out of there right. It's unbelievable. Yeah you know when William Branham had fallen out with people boy you learned every bad thing that person ever did so so we know we know some fun stories I guess we'll share as we as we we get up there especially that spot with India yeah I know we finished our last episode talking about his tour into Europe the first time through Scandinavia.

in 1950, and his tour, his next tour overseas was in 1951, it was the last three months in 1951, he went to South Africa and also into Rhodesia, which is in Bobway today. And what's really interesting, I think this should be pointed out, is Roy Davis is actually back in the picture before this tour to South Africa happens.

So we'll talk about that more in another full episode, but just be aware Roy Davis has come back in the picture between his first and second tours. And he may have been in the picture before, but again, we're solidly certain that he's come back into the picture as you come into 1951.

Right, and to set the scene properly, you've got Gordon Lenzoo, who's running the voice of healing publication, and they're largely covering William Branham's tours. And this is nearing the point in time, in which Gordon Lenzoo and William Branham and many, many other ministers in the voice of healing had this falling out, which we'll get into.

They actually had multiple fallings out, but this is the first time that is building up. And Roy Davis initiates this falling out. He, you know, William Branham told this life story, which we've pointed out has many conflicting and interesting details.

And William Branham's inner circle will have heard this very, all of the different variations of this life story. And in their minds, they're, you know, they're kind of like us, they're thinking, we'll wait a minute.

If he said thing A, and also thing B, and C, D, E, and F, and none of them can go together, well, how do I reconcile this? And Roy Davis sends a letter, I'll put it up on the video version of this podcast, but he sends this letter to Gordon Lenzoo in the voice of healing.

And he completely gives all of the, he discredits William Branham's life story, basically. William Branham is claiming to be a Baptist minister who stumbled on Depentecostalism and had never heard of divine healing. And he, you know, he builds up to this story, right?

And Roy Davis sends this, this letter that, which is published in the voice of healing that says, no, no, no. I was the minister who baptized William Branham into his first, first Pentecostal assembly.

And you can, you can read the comments from Gordon Lenzoo under the letter. I'll, you know, I'll put it up on the, on the screen here, but it's just, it, it's crazy because now all of these men know, wait a minute.

This guy is, he's, for lack of a better way to say it, he's full of it. Yeah, it definitely Roy Davis outs William Branham a little bit as you come, come up through that period of time.

And it's, it's going to be interesting when we do a full episode on that, just to talk through some of the stuff that happened leading up in ultimately to, to the breakup of voice of healing.

William Branham's breakup with the voice of healing, I should say. but as we come here into the end in 1951 and they are starting to move overseas again to South Africa, William Brownham, you know, puts together a campaign team to go to South Africa and what's kind of interesting on that front, John, if you kind of examine the people involved in the South Africa tour as compared to the ones on his first year P&Tour, he don't actually seem to take any laterane people with him on his second tour. So his first tour to Europe, you

know, he had Joseph Metz and Bozay, he had some other very significant laterane people, but it looks like the one to South Africa is almost purely a healing revival, a voice-a-healing tour. There's only voice-a-healing men going with him, so it seems like it's probably a less laterane influence tour. But as he goes, he does take FF Bosworth with him, he takes Ern Baxter, he takes Julius Sideski, I always have, I always say his name wrong, but Julius Sideski, the man who wrote this book about the tour and everything that happened down there, and I apologize

for saying the name wrong, it's just, it's a, it's a difficult name. It's not, yeah, it's not a normal American ending name, and so he goes along and he writes this book and just talks about all the kinds of stuff that happens, you know, all the, takes pictures, photographs, documents, the tour really well, it's called a profit visit South Africa. There's also many write-ups on this tour through voice-a-healing magazine. This is, this is definitely William Brown, his biggest most famous overseas tour, and he attracts what seems to be the largest crowd at any of his meetings at one of these events in South Africa, particularly the

meeting in Durban, supposedly has an attendance of 100,000, so it really is very huge, and you know, one thing I think that is really interesting, probably one of the first things that I would want to point out too, John, you know, so if you went to South Africa, you'd expect, you know, you'd expect that the majority of people you preach to, the majority of people that are healed and all that are going to be a certain kind of people, right? I mean, that's one thing you'd kind of expect. Well, that's what we were taught, right? We were taught that it was the

healing, the reason for the healing wasn't showmanship, and that's what differentiated William Brannum from all of the others, the thousands of others who were doing the same thing. It was that the healing was to attract them to the message, and the message was to be the bride of Christ, and we were to be this elite group that's better than all other Christians. But what happened was a little bit different, if you know what I'm saying. Yeah, you know, when when William Brannum went over there, so he was over there for 10 full weeks, and you'll find a

little bit about this in the healer prophet. And you'll also find, you know, brief mention about this in David Edwin-Harrill's book, but the the key figures organizing William Brannem's tours in South Africa were incredibly racists Right, and they did not want him to minister to the African Peoples and of the 10 weeks that he was there I believe if I if I've read this right and again I've I've went through carefully noting all of these things About nine of the 10 weeks was spent ministering to white only audiences Yeah, and and the and the and a very small minority of the time was spent keep preaching to

revivals with the with the mixed crowds His his obviously his biggest meeting in Durban was was a mixed one So you know that one is very well known and everyone thinks well the whole tour was like Durban No, no, the whole the majority of the tour was overwhelmingly William Brannem's preaching to white only churches He he did however have a few mixed Revival meetings and if you read it he taught in here in the books it talks about these were meetings for the natives meetings for the natives so they were kind of special Special little native meetings that he had and and what's really interesting to John

So in in Julius Sideski's book in the in the end of it. There's about this is probably one quarter of the book and through this through this quarter of the book there is testimony after testimony of people that are healed right and and they gives their testimonies it gives their pictures And as you come through here, I mean you you can just Look at all their pictures read their testimonies. You know learn all about them, right? Yeah Um every single one of them is white John There's there's not a every single picture every single person in these healing testimonies is is is white people and so

To me, that's just a little unusual. How do you go to Africa and have you know 10 week tour and your book You know That you come back publicizing it you only have your healing section testimonies is only got pictures of white people You know, I've put a lot of thought into that question because You know in this era you cannot say that Based on this alone that any of these men were racist But yet at the same time we have other examples of key figures in American Christianity who were publishing articles of both black and white people

So You've got this distinct difference between William Brannum and the men who were in his inner circle and the other leading figures in Pentecostalism and Just fundamentalist Christianity who were openly displayed the fact that they have interracial revivals and meetings. So there's one key difference.

There's another element to this that I will never get the answer to the question, but it will always be in the back of my mind. You have to put into perspective the overall timeline of what would happen with William Brannum and Roy Davis. It was during these years that Davis was rising up to become the imperial wizard of the original night to the Ku Klux Klan. And he was fighting harsh battles through Louisiana, Texas, Arkansas, Oklahoma, Florida, basically everywhere from Florida to mid-Taxis, right? And then a little bit north. So he is fighting all these battles to basically

build himself up and work his way up. Well, then you see William Brannum, who's just been outed by Roy Davis. And you see this moment of separation, even in the recordings of William Brannum, he kind of transitions to I was with. He's still called him Dr. Davis, and even though he wasn't a doctor, I was with Dr. Davis, but we had this disagreement over my angel. And here's Davis completely overturning this whole angel story in the newsletter. So the question forms in your mind. Here's William Brannum, who's only portraying white people in these revivals, even though

there's several black people who claim to be healed in Africa. We can't deny that there are several that claim this, but he's advertising only the white. So the question that forms in my mind, which I'll never answer because these men are all dead, was William Brannum creating healthy competition for Roy Davis during these years? Yeah, it's an unusual thing. I look through this. It's a curious oddity to me, really. In the first half of the book, you do get pictures of his crowds and different things. But really, when you stand back and you look at it,

for a trip to Africa, it's just very unusual. The ratios of things that you see in this book, it's just unusual. So it's very clear, it's all the evidence does really indicate that he was primarily doing white only stuff when he was in Africa. And when you read like the He the Prophet or some of the more scholarly biographies, they kind of blame the committee that organized his meetings. They said the committee was racist and that they only wanted to have the white only meetings. And they sort of give William Brannum a little bit of an out on that. But it's, you know,

it's clear he went along with it anyway. So at any rate, I think that one point you can draw away from this is that we would say William Brannum, one of the great evidences that William Brannum loved all races and really was a true multicultural man was that he went to these foreign countries and visited all of these foreign peoples to preach to them, right?

Like that was one of our ways to exonerate him from a claim of racism, for example. But the truth is, if you actually look at it, no, that's not really an accurate representation of what happened when he was overseas.

He primarily ministered only to white people as well overseas. And what's difficult about this, John, for me, is that I think maybe a lot of people don't have the context of history. South Africa was an apartheid country back then.

It was deeply racist, deeply divided, deeply separated. And the city where he did have his big meetings in Durban, that was the home of Muhammad Gandhi, actually. Muhammad Gandhi was from Durban, right? And so that actually had more to do with the large multicultural crowd size that came than anything else.

He was in Muhammad Gandhi's hometown. Not long after Muhammad Gandhi has been assassinated, right? And in that town, there's basically all the restrictions are lifted. Interracial stuff is permitted to a large degree because of Gandhi.

And you almost cannot have a multiracial event there. And a lot of the people there are keen and primed to come together basically to do this in acts of unity in Durban throughout the years because of Gandhi and what Gandhi had done there.

So there's just a large history in Durban. And I've been to Durban, John. I've been to Africa and visit message believers in Africa before. And in Durban, there's a history of this multicultural coming together in large events, going all the way back to Gandhi and celebration of Gandhi.

And that is part of what William Brannum is building on when he has his big meetings in Durban, which of course the message people never tell you that, do they? But that's the truth.

Yeah, and there's something that also should be pointed out. Again, and we're going back to the public image versus the private image. There will also be message believers. And you'll probably find this in some, even some of the pro William Brannum books, who came in contact with William Brannum during these revivals that he held.

It's not that he was exclusively separating himself from white, but the operation was to the white from what we can tell, at least from the history that you pointed out. Yeah, William Brannum had, in the best case scenario, he had, I would say, like a patronizing form of racism.

In the best case scenario, right, it was, It was very patronizing of non-whites, and it's terrible, you know, and they really, they believe, and we're going to get into this when we do an episode on serpent seed and so forth, John, they really believe that black people are the descendent of the serpent, and your other non-rises are as well, you know, slavery.

Our pastor was a deep apologist for slavery, very apologetic for slavery, you know, we'll get into that, and speaking of that, I believe on the South Africa tour, isn't this where William Brandham got his slave statue that, John, is this when that came into the picture?

I believe it was, and I'll put an image of the statue up for the viewers who are watching the YouTube version of this, but it is the most racist thing that I have ever seen.

I did not know this existed until, it was actually like, maybe two years ago, I learned of this, but it was openly displayed and is still openly displayed, and it is, I mean, it is right down to the most horrific thing that I have ever seen, and it is on display in the museum of William Brandham that they keep in his den.

Yeah, it is, it is absolutely incredible, and not your spot on. It is the, I'm the same thing, John, it is the most racist thing I have ever laid my eyes on in my life, and yeah, it's on display in William Brandham's den in his memorial.

It's incredible, it's incredible, you know, and what kind of a person would want something like that in their house? Yeah, and again, I'll point out the difference between the public image and the private image. Nobody, nobody knew of this.

I certainly did not know, and I was in the family that's in William Brandham's inner circle. So in private, he's got this horrific slavery statue. In public, he's saying that he's against slavery, it's wrong, and all of these things.

Again, go back to the other ministers who were openly supportive of equality of races. They would have never dreamed of owning one of these things. In fact, had they saw one, they probably would have taken it and tried to destroy it.

But William Brandham puts it on display in his den, which later becomes his museum. Yeah, it's something else, something else. So, you know, William Brandham's tour, you know, through South Africa, like I said, it took about 10 weeks.

At the time, the society in Africa, the British Empire, still ruled South, the southern parts of Africa at this point. It was still very, very segregated, very racist, and you know, it continued to be that way.

I think up until the 1990s, John, South Africa, Rhodesia's in Bobway. I think they changed, I believe, in the 70s or 70s, I believe. They switched over, but South Africa. continued to be in a part-time country up through the 1990s, I believe, so that it continued for a very long time this this very racist structure of leadership style in South Africa. So I think it you know it might have been fair to say that they're even more rigid than it was in the United States in how they structured races in South Africa and long after segregation had been

banned in the United States, it continued to live on in South Africa. So it's something else. So anyways William Brannum, he goes around, he has his tours, he visits most of the major cities in South Africa and he does make one stop in Rhodesia's in Bobway and through all of that there's all kinds of testimonies, a healing. I mean just all kinds, John, and Julius Sideski puts him in his book. If you read through here, there's there's probably a good 75 to 100 cases of reported healings in this book, which it really seems to be

an amazing thing. But just like every other single country that William Brannum went to and had tours, the looks didn't match reality. There's a man named Wyman Miller, him and several other ministers in South Africa investigated the healings from William Brannum South Africa campaigns and they did it right and immediate aftermath of the tour. And there are over 40 cases in this book, John, that they have documented of failed healings that happened on these tours in South Africa. It really is incredible. And I did want to just read one of them here because I've tried with every one of our tours and everything I've tried to

just convey to our readers that these things were not what they seemed. These failed healings were not happening just once or twice here there, but they were happening everywhere on every tour every time. And I really want to I want to bring that home again on the South Africa tour by reading just one of the failed healing stories out of it. And so here's the here's the story of one case.

This is a doctor named Michael Plaz and I'm just going to read read the read this read it out of this book here. Says Dr. Michael Plaz 23 years old was a houseman at Addington Hospital. As a medical student, he had leukemia but bravely carried out his studies. You know leukemia was the same thing that Carol Ruth Strubler had. He knew he was doomed in the human sense but showed amazing pluck. I was there when Brannum dramatically singled him out and said cancer of the blood you are cured. It was in a big dramatic way but I suspected

that William Brannum knew all along that he was in the audience near the front for he was a hospital case and a doctor besides in many others knew of his presence. Well doc Dr. Plas went back to the hospital.

He discharged himself the next morning, strongly against the advice of the medical superintendent. He went to his home in Sheppstone, seemed well for twelve hours, and then got sick again, and was dead in less than a month.

But this is not the worst. An American paper contained an article by Bosworth on the Durban Campaign. In it, Bosworth cites this wonderful cure of Dr. Plas, adding that the hospital staff examined him the next day and found his blood entirely free from cancer, whereas exactly the opposite had been the case.

The medical staff thought he was foolish to leave, and there had been no change in his blood condition, and they were proved right. The same Boston article mentioned crowds of 80,000 to 100,000 at the Grayville Race Horse, whereas its utmost capacity is just over 20,000.

Of course, his friends in the States would not know any better on this point, and they would follow it as it stands. It's incredible, isn't it, John? Here's a doctor. William Brandham's told him he's healed.

He leaves the hospital, he goes off his medical treatment, he dies, and Bosworth and the Brandham Campaign come back to America publishing newspaper stories about him being healed, and he's already dead and buried, and they're publishing newspaper articles about him being healed.

And that's a common pattern through these things. People are, many of the people that they say are healed are actually dead and buried, and they're coming around telling their testimonies, kind of like the King George story.

Yeah. And you know, again, back to the public image, the private image, these weren't men who were champions against divine healing, but that's the way they've been portrayed. In every one of these revivals from the earliest that we can find that are recorded until William Brandham's death, you're going to find men who are stepping forward and saying, no, this wasn't the case, I know of 10, 15, 20, 100 cases where William Brandham's alleged healing failed.

And the cult and the inner circle and the publicists, they all point to these men as though they're champions of the devil, basically, but all they're doing is throwing a counterbalance to the scale.

They're telling us these men publicly are making these claims and they're only having a selection of the people, of the overall people that were prayed for and pronounced as healed. But here are, here's the counterbalance to the scale.

Here are the ones that aren't healed. And I'd like to point out, you know, public image versus private image, we were, you know, we were indoctrinated to think that we don't listen to any of these testimonies because that's the devil trying to influence us away from, from believing William Brandham.

You'll even find that in the comments of our previous videos and podcasts. believers who will come and say, you're only talking about the failures. What about the hundreds that were healed? I question where there are hundreds, but we're also just showing the counterbalance of the scale, you know, and public image versus private image. There are things going on behind the scenes of all of this that when it leaks out, it's totally distorted and twisted. For example, William Brannum claimed that he was this great hunter, this Native American who respected the land and the animals, and he only ate what he killed, and you two should only

you two should only kill what you eat. I said that backwards. And so there are there are many hunters today that they'll they'll hunt and they make sure that they eat what they kill because this is what the man said. And then these safari pictures start surfacing of William Brannum, and well, what do you do with this? Here's William Brannum, who's in this tour in Africa, and he's he's paid for some kind of hunting excursion tour, and they're taking him where he can from a Jeep, pick off, you know, large game, you know, take him down, have his picture taken with him,

and he's just slaughtering all these animals. There's no way that William Brannum ate a zebra. I'm going to say that the man did not eat the zebra, right? But we have photos of him shooting zebras and elk and, you know, all of these different animals. And he's in the private image, the private side of the outside of the public view. When we came across these photographs, this was this great thing because he's William Brannum, the mighty hunter. And we weren't really allowed to think, well, wait a minute, he's not practicing what he's preaching because he's out

there having fun. And I should point out, I don't think it was this tour. I think it was one of the later ones, but he's out there wearing shorts. We actually have a photograph of the man who is calling all of the men, quote unquote, sissies for wearing shorts. And here he is standing there on a safari in Africa wearing shorts. And we noticed a long time ago that in this photograph, his legs are tan, suggesting that he often wore shorts. Yeah, it really is something else.

When you just step back and you take the blinders off because, you know, again, I still have some, I still have some affection, I guess, in my heart towards William Brannum, John, you might say, how is that possible? Well, I don't know, but I do, to some degree, you know, and it's, you know, I heard someone say it like this. There's a preacher friend of mine said it like this, John. He said, you know, if you, if you're, if you're, is unfaithful to you and your relationship deteriorates. Well, that don't mean you didn't love her back before she was unfaithful, right? You know, really with William Brandham, this

is the same thing. We loved William Brandham. He was God's prophet. We loved William Brandham, but it turned out he had been unfaithful to us. And you know, that don't mean that we didn't really love him. And that's why our heart is broke so bad. You know, and I know for me, that's why my heart breaks so bad. Not because I never believe the message. My heart breaks because I did believe this thing. And I love this stuff. And I love William Brandham. And it's breaks my heart to find out how unfaithful he was. And you know, when it comes to these healing things,

like you mentioned, you know, it's not about just trying to make William Brandham look bad. That's not it at all. But God, God don't work in terms of percentages. You know what I mean? God's not, you know, you don't say, well, God has a 80% success rate. Are you kidding me? You know, you don't say God has a 98% success rate. No, you know, God has 100% success rate, right? And so you can't, you can't, you can't even do what some of these people in the message try to do with these facts.

You cannot, and you can't just look the other way and pretend that these things are not here and did not happen. There were massive amounts of people who were pronounced healed on every one of these campaigns. And they did not get better and many of them died. That is the reality. William Brandham, thus said the Lord pronounced all kinds of people healed. And many of them died. And there's just no way around that. God's not a failure, right? God don't fail. But clearly, there's something wrong here with what William Brandham is doing. And so what do you do with that?

Yeah, and I'll point out Charles, you're relatively new out of the message. It's kind of funny, because I've watched you struggle not to say the phrase brother Brandham. And I've watched you, and inside I chuckle every time because I struggle at this point. I'm so far beyond this now that I actually struggle not to call him anti-Christ Brandham. So there's there's this big difference between us. But we were indoctrinated to to feel this affection. We were we were manipulated to feel this false affection. And what's really interesting is I personally know message believers who are well

recognized in the message who have spoken with people in Islam. And they make this argument, now think about this argument, Charles. They make this argument, why do you have this affection for the Prophet Muhammad? He's dead. He's gone. And the God you serve, the God of Islam, Islam is supposed to be the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, which is the God that the Christians believe.

Why don't you believe in Christianity? Why are you beholden to the Prophet Muhammad who's dead? And their response, well, we love him. He's the one who showed us the way. He has a special place in our hearts.

We don't think Muhammad is God, but he was God's prophet. And think about that. I mean, this is in the message cult. It's the same exact thing. You've got real Christians who are now talking to the message people who are talking to the Islam people.

And they're saying, well, why do you? Why do you hold this reverence to William Brannum? He's dead. He's gone. Why is it William Brannum? You serve a God. And the similarities are overwhelming, but we were indoctrinated to be this way.

So as time goes on, I strongly suspect you'll come to my conclusion. You'll be fighting back. It's very difficult not to call him anti-Christ Brannum instead of a brother Brannum. Yeah. So, you know, because we loved him so much and we had this aura around him, there are things that we just overlooked.

I know in our sect of the message, this is going towards that hunting stuff, John. We believe that he was the return of Elijah and he had the Elijah anointing. So he had to do all these Elijah E things, right? And among these Elijah-like things that he had to do is he had to be an outdoorsman.

He had to be an outdoorsman hunter wilderness man, right? Like that was one of our... Did you all believe that in your sect that he... We did. I've made this joke and I'll probably get the word drunk. It's been so long since I've thought about it.

But we had this whole plethora of men who had, you know, had they not been in the cult, they would have never ever picked up a gun to hunt. But they were unnaturally indoctrinated to believe that they too should be like the prophet Elijah.

So you've got these men who are out there who don't even want to be out there. And also they were indoctrinated with the very weird, very unusual things that William Brannum said. One of which is a story I'll tell here. William Brannum said that he's talking about the water of life and, you know, he tries to bring this Elijah stage persona in.

He says that if a deer, if you shoot it and it makes it to water, if it drinks, that deer will survive because it's the water, the giver of life. And this... Yeah, so some friends of mine were out hunting one time and this guy shot a deer and then the deer...

He wasn't a good shot and he missed, you know, got... did not get the heart. Well the deer went and then fell over dead, completely dead, but his head fell in the water and the guy just starts stabbing it with a knife and, you know, just...

The guy said, what are you doing? into this deer was head fell in the water. I don't want to get up and get up and run again. So he was worried about the zombie deer because of William Brannum.

Wow, that's incredible. Yeah, you know, out being an outdoorsman and hunting is roughly the only acceptable hobby in the message.

And a very, an overwhelmingly large percentage of message men follow in that hobby. Again, because it's really the only acceptable hobby in the message, you know, any other hobby you're liable to get whacked for.

You know, preacher's going to preach a sermon at you if you have a hobby that, you know, the profit didn't have. I know people who the only video game there were a lot to play is the big game hunter video game.

Yeah, so William Brannum on this trip to Africa. He went on a great big safari. He shot all kinds of animals and we got all the pictures of that you can put up, but I think the biggest thing here and, and again, I don't think a lot of people in the message know this, all of these accusations of failed healings and all of this stuff.

This actually created a real big stigma around William Brannum in South Africa. And when he tried to come back to South Africa the second time, which he did, he came back to South Africa again in 1965 South Africa banned him from holding revivals.

They put restrictions on his visa to basically shut him down. You know, the same thing that happened on his first tour to Europe and ended up in Norway. They basically shut down his healing revivals.

The same thing happened in South Africa. South Africa shut down William Brannum's healing revivals as a result of all the failed healings and things going on around the campaigns. And again, that just says something to me.

It says something to me that now this is the second country that has put a stop to his healing campaigns. Yeah, and I always, you know, we'll never have the answers to all these questions.

But at that point in time, when he returned the second time, Roy Davis had risen to the Imperial Wizard and William Brannum had reconnected with him. And you have to wonder was there some South African intelligence that knew these connections and, you know, there's so much more to the story that we'll never know.

Yeah, so that's the South Africa tour. And so William Brannum came back home at the end of 1951. I think he was back home by Christmas. I think his tour went through close to the end of December.

So he's back home for Christmas. And from there, he actually stayed home for all in 1952 and all in 1953, I believe. Yeah, in both 1952 and 1953, he stayed home and he's touring mainly in North America again.

And so I don't know, John, do we have time? Do you want to go on to talk about his third tour overseas? We have to get to the India story, man. I had this video that I put up long time ago, when I discovered the back and forth on this prophecy, I made this little jingle of a video where he's saying the vision failed because I went to India first, the vision failed because I went to Africa first.

He said it, he could not even remember the lie to cover up the failed prophecy, but before William Brannum made this tour, he prophesied that he said, when we land in India, you're going to hear of tens of thousands, times tens, thousands being saved, which we never heard, right?

And the prophecy, remember, he said that if one single detail failed, one detail, you can hang a sign on my back and call me a false prophet. And he says things like, if I go down as a false prophet, I'll take my soul and yours with me.

So he's telling everybody, watch what he says, and then this happens. Nobody hears of tens of thousands, times tens, thousands being saved when they return. And he had to admit the failure. Well, he said it was because of his travel, itinerary.

He said, these other guys wanted me to go somewhere else first. And because of them, God's prophecy failed. So we've got to get into the India. Yeah, okay, well, let's get there. So in a second tour is rather his third tour overseas, that started in 1954.

So we're skipping ahead some time, just to put kind of focus on these tours. So in 1954, he takes another overseas tour. And this one also seems to be really a voice of healing tour.

There's no, you know, there is some laterane people in his entourage though as well. So although it's voice of healing is the main one sponsoring this, there are laterane people coming along on this third tour again.

This is important because this does kind of impact the flavor of things that happens through these things. So on this third tour, he takes overseas, he goes to Portugal, then he goes to Italy.

And then after that, he travels on to make a tour in India. And so this takes up a good part of the year 1954. And so as he does this, you know, the reality is,

this whole tour really ends up kind of being a flop, this 1954 tour. None of the crowds really turn out anywhere. None of it turns out to be anything very large. And one way that you can know that this is true is that through voice of healing magazine or like his overseas, they publish this book, there's always tons of publicity about William Brownham's campaigns, right?

If he got a large crowd, you better bet there's gonna be pictures of it all over the place, right? And there's gonna be all kinds of articles about it, right? That's the pattern. Right. There is, to the best of my knowledge, not a single picture, John, of any of these campaign events on this tour to Portugal, Italy, and India, not a single picture. You can read Voice of Healing magazine through that whole period. There's not a single article about it, John. It's such a flop that they basically pretend that the tour never even happened, honestly, as you read through it all. I found one photograph of what two photographs I believe

it was of the India tour, and it's as though he's speaking in some small Pentecostal church. You know, there's, there's not a lot of people there. It's nothing like the other photographs where they have hundreds of thousands of people in some tent or auditorium. This is, literally, this is, William Branham is in a church, and he's speaking to a few people in a Pentecostal church in India. Yeah. What, what I can gather from reading all the material we have access to, this is, you know, he rarely has more than a few hundred people in attendance at any of these

meetings that are on this tour, which is minuscule, right? Miniscule compared to what he had been getting up to this point. So there's just tiny crowds coming to these meetings. It's so small that he's embarrassed to publish any pictures or detailed information on the campaign that crowds are so small, right? Yeah. And it just, it just kind of proves out as you look through all the records on the, on the tours that, that the tour was a flop. Now there are some, there are some interesting things though that happen on these tours. Yes, there are. And as we work towards India,

maybe let me start with a couple of the interesting things that happened in Europe. So after his, after you know, about a week of meetings in Portugal, he went to Italy, did about a week of meetings in Italy. In Italy, he went to Rome, and he got to go to the Vatican, John, and see St. Peter Square and all that. And here, and of course, we know, you know, William Branham is the most anti-Catholic preacher. I mean, of the era, perhaps, you know, I don't know the more anti-Catholic preacher than William Branham, John. And here he goes to Rome to the Vatican, and he makes a lot of

hay out of this through the years, doesn't he? I mean, he talks about how he got to see the papal tiara, and he got to see the papal throne. And basically, he can confirm to us personally that every evil thing is true, right, about the Pope. It's very much like Place Pagal. From a personal sense, Place Pagal was the epitome of the worst thing that you could go see. And he says, I want to go see it. So I went and saw it when saw these naked people. Well, from a religious sense, Rome, and the places that he's describing in Rome are from

religious sense, the same epitome of evil. Well, I've got to go see it. It just doesn't make any sense. Yeah. And, and you know, again, we don't, we're not defending the Catholic Church. They've got, they've got their fair share of problems, right? So we're, that's certainly not what we're doing is defending the Catholic Church. But William Brownham, though, he just, he actually made up a lot of stuff that you saw in Rome. There's, there's stories he said, I saw this, that, or the other.

And there's no such thing. They don't exist. One, one very prominent thing he made up is he claimed that he saw the words vicarious fielidei, which is 666, right? Yeah. Wrote over the top of the papal throne, right? That was a very big, a very big claim that he made.

But there's no, there's no 666 wrote that this does not exist, right? Like he just, he just made up quite a number of things on this tour. And again, you, you can get pictures, you can look at the, what's over the papal throne. There is Latin writing up on a lot of the walls, but none of its vicarious fielis di, none of it is 666, right? Like it's, it's, it's just not true. And I'll give maybe shoot you a picture that you could put up on the screen of what it really, what really is there.

So, so that happened. It was a strategy is a propaganda strategy, basically, to come back and present the notion to all of the people who are on the fence of whether or not his end of day's prophecies are correct. And he says, well, I just saw 666 above the Pope. This is it. I'm right.

And they believe, I know people that believe it. They still say that this really happened. But this, well, like you said, this did not happen. Yeah. He basically presents himself, I, you know, the prophet of the age have went on this fact finding tour to Rome. And I have indeed confirmed, yes, everything I've told you about the Catholic Church is true. And I've solved this, you know, evidence of it. So he does that. After he leaves Rome, he, he heads to India. But on the way to India, John, here we got another king story. On the way to

India, he has a layover in Cairo, Egypt. And I've got a quote on this we can put up on the screen. But on his layover to India in Cairo, he said he claims to have met King Farouk of Egypt.

1954. So this is another one of the famous kings that he got to meet.

But there's a problem, isn't there, John, you know, with, with meeting King Farouk in Egypt in 1954. And let me share what that problem is. If it's not obvious to our listeners. So Egypt had overthrown the monarchy and they didn't have a king in 1954, John. And they're, and their former king, former King Farouk didn't even live in Egypt at the time. He had been exiled years before.

So there was no king Farouk in Cairo, Egypt in 1954 when William Bram... and I went to Cairo. So again, it seems like he made that story up about meeting the king of Egypt because Egypt did not have a king at the time.

It reminds me of the traveling magic elixir salesman on the Bananza show. He's going into town saying, I healed the mayor of that city and this other city. Just go ask him. You can see that I healed the mayor's and William Brannum's on an international scale.

I healed the king. I healed the other king. I healed the third king. Just go ask him and he never saw one of these guys. It's incredible, John. It, you know, for me, it's still just a knife in the heart to find out how he made this stuff up, right?

Yeah. Especially with these kings, the angel told him that he was going to stand before these kings and to find out that every single one of these king stories was a made up hoax is unbelievable to me.

Still to this day, it is unbelievable, John. That he made up all these king stories. And so after that, he finally goes to India. He gets to India. And in India, he, again, there's zero pictures that come out of this.

It really seems like he did have meetings, but in terms of numbers, in terms of something for him to write home and brag about, it seems like the India tour was a total flop, honestly.

And like you had mentioned, William Brannum had had this, he had this vision, right, before he went over there. And he shared this vision many times with people. It's on tape. And he, or less, was thus say at the Lord that he was going to, here I've got a quote of it.

Right here, let me read it to you. This is from 1954, questions and answers. William Brannum says, mark my word, write it on your pages of your Bible, for it's thus say at the Lord.

Remember, when we land in India, so this is just a few months before he goes, when we land in India, you're going to hear of 10,000s times 10,000s being saved. The Holy Spirit has said it.

I've wrote it here in my Bible. It's wrote in 10,000 Bibles right here, like the resurrection of the little boy by the vision that he said. Remember that? Remember how the boy from 10th story was a hoax, too?

Three, there is 300,000 of them in there. William Brannum is prophesying thus say at the Lord, he's going to have 300,000 people attend his meeting in India, and 10,000s times 10,000s is going to be saved.

And so that is the expectation he has set with his audiences and his followers before he left. But this thing was a total flop. It can nowhere near, near to that. Yeah, Charles, it's just, it's so unbelievable.

Think about this from a business standpoint. This was a business. This was up. rated as a business. They were the full gospel business men. And think of it strategically, what minister today, what evangelist today plans a tour without doing all of the planning on the other side, the advertising, you know, building the crowds, bringing people to come. These men did not do this before they went into these countries. There was no targeted advertising to let people know that they're coming on the scale to which they presented themselves when they came back. There was probably a little bit of advertisement, but nothing

to show the crowds for these prophecy, these alleged prophecies. I have to say this looks very much like they, and they were getting donations for this. Give us money because I've got this prophecy we're going to go overseas. This looks very much like they were wanting a good vacation. And they got people to fund it. And they went overseas and had a vacation. And while on vacation, they went to a few small churches so they could take a few photographs, write a few articles. But we're going to get into some very interesting things that happened while in India. And that combined with the pictures that we do have

combined with what we know about this meeting. For me, I can't look at this any other way. This was a vacation that, as a side effect, had a few handful of meetings. Yeah, so that's an interesting take, John. I have to think about that. That certainly has some things to recommend itself. I think that what happens over here in India is definitely from the perspective of his audience's back home, a crash and burn. It definitely was not what he set up, set up his people to expect. And when he comes back home from this thing, he is, he's in cover-up mode in some extent, coming home, right? Like he's got

to, he was very public in these, thus say, at the lords about what this trip was supposed to be. And he comes back home and he goes immediately into an explanation as he was so public in this. And this is one of the few times where William Brownham actually more or less publicly admits his prophecy failed, right? Most of the time it's like King George.

And he just keeps on telling the story for the rest of his life. But this one was such a failure that even like William Brownham could, there's no way he could spin this into having happened. And so he has to somehow explain this away. And he does what you mentioned a little earlier. He more or less says that he didn't follow the vision properly. So God failed to honor the vision. And...

He makes up the story that the angel came to him and told him he was supposed to go to Africa before he went to India. And then things would have been fulfilled. But remember, he already went to Africa. Didn't we just talk about that?

So he said that the reason that the Indian vision failed was because he didn't go to Africa first. But he did go to Africa first. So it's really difficult to understand this. So what he does is after this India trip and the crowds don't materialize that he's prophesied, he basically carries his prophecy forward for the rest of his life.

Saying, well, it's still going to happen. It's still going to happen at this point in the future. It's still going to happen. He thought it was going to happen after his 1965 trip to South Africa, right when he was banned from preaching again in South Africa.

So he keeps chasing this vision his whole life. This does say at the Lord vision. And it never, it never comes to pass, John. It never happens. This, this is another one of the very well documented, very clear, very easy to understand.

Thus say at the Lord prophecies of William Brannum that utterly failed, utterly failed. It was a monumental failure. And what's interesting is his cover up scheme. After having told all of these people for all of these years, if you find one single detail that's incorrect, one detail, then I'm a false prophet and you can hang a false prophet sign on my back.

I mean, think of this. God who knows everything. If God is the one speaking, God knows everything. God knows that this is not going to happen. So if it is actually God speaking, then we've got a false God. And that's another reason that I stack up for my anti-Christ Brannum label that I give him.

But that aside, this is a thing that there's no way to escape it. But what's really interesting is after, after it failed, after he admits that it failed, that's whenever he begins trying to twist it and revise it.

And over the next series of years, he's going to say that it is about to happen. Even though he said it will happen, the moment we land, when we get back, when we land, you're going to hear of it.

It's going to be such a big explosion of message believers that did not happen. And there are people today that anticipate this prophecy happening or claim that it did after his death by the small population of growth of message believers in India.

But still, it did not happen as quote unquote God said that it happened. How he manipulated people to believe it after he admitted that it failed. It's beyond me. I'll never know. Now, there is some things that did happen in India that are going to resonate for years to come.

And one thing is that while he's in India, William Brandon meets. man named Paulazir Lowry. Yes. He's a figure we've got to make sure we can mention here, John. I got one of Paulazir Lowry's books here called The Son of Man, and Paulazir Lowry kind of ends up being William Brandham's chief lieutenant in India, you know, coming out of these meetings in India.

And you know, the movement grows, and if you notice the title of this book is called The Son of Man. It's one of Lowry's tracks. You know, Paulazir Lowry becomes very caught up in the manifested sons of God theology.

And you know, William Brandham, all his son of man teachings was really derivatives of the manifested sons of God theology. And so Paulazir Lowry, he builds a large network of churches in India that, you know, I believe it's over 25 churches.

So, you know, I guess that's large by message standards anyway. So he's got, you know, a good size network of churches in India that he's put together. And they're growing a base of message believers in India through the years.

And what's really interesting, John, this picture here that I held up, and you can put it up on the screen for the people, if you look in the background of that picture of what's behind William Brandham in Paulazir Lowry, so they're actually in the United States for that picture.

Paulazir Lowry came to the United States many times and what's in the background of that picture are the trailer homes of Jean and Leo's commune. That's what's in the background of the picture of Paulazir Lowry.

So the molestation torture commune, message commune, that's what's in the background of this picture, which is unbelievable. And symbolically, this is the manifested sons of God theology. This is the theology that created Jim Jones and the Jonestown commune and Paul Schaefer and the colonial dignidad commune.

All of these various splinter groups that emerged as these very, very destructive cults, just like this one, it's all built on the manifested sons of God platform. Yeah. And as Paulazir Lowry gets going, he actually becomes a pretty well-known message minister coming up into the 60s and after brother Brannum's death as well.

And he attracts, after William Brannum dies, he attracts a large following. He more or less sees himself as William Brannum's successor after William Brannum dies. And he then becomes the next manifested son of God.

He believes he became, again, you can read it, I'm not making this stuff up. He believes that while watching the moon landing in 1969 on television, he was in Chicago at the time, watching the moon landing that Jesus Christ returned in him.

And he became the next manifested son of God at the same time. you know, that the, you know, one small step for man, a giant leap for mankind. The exact same moment that hub happens, Paul Lowry becomes Jesus Christ, to reincarnate.

One small step for Lowry, one large step for Brannemkind. I know. And so these become the, some of the most extreme sex of the message pour out of this. And he, he actually, he was in Chicago at that time.

He attracts a substantial number of people from the United States and Canada, moved to India. And he, these people, they really believe William Brannem was God incarnate. They move on to think Lowry is the next God incarnate.

And there, they become very, very radical and a lot of really unusual things happen in their movements. And Paul Lowry maintains a large following. I believe all the way up till, you know, his last years of life.

And he actually has quite an impact in India, as far as, you know, from what I understand. I am still contacted today by members of that group. And what's interesting is the vast majority of message believers, message cult believers in the United States believe that William Brannem's India prophecy succeeded.

And that there was this growth of message believers because of his trip. And therefore his prophecy, therefore must have succeeded. What they don't know is this is how it succeeded. It is crazy, you know.

They, they bet their group baptizes and prays in the name of the Lord, Brannem Christ. It's, it is a, it's bizarre, John. And it, it's actually scary, heretical stuff, you know, where that, that sect of people went.

And sadly, I mean, that is one of William Brannem's chief legacies in India is that, that really horrendous cult. Yeah. So that happened in India. One other story too, John, before we get to the very best story of all.

So there's one other thing, William Brannem claimed, you know, that he did on this tour to India. He, he claimed that on this tour that he visited the grave of Buddha of Confucius and of Muhammad, right?

Like he, and he bragged about this quite a few times. How he visited the grave of Buddha and Confucius and Muhammad on this trip. But there's some problems there at the John. There's some big problems.

Now, the, the first one, and this one is, it's kind of obvious once you think about it, but Buddha was cremated. He don't have a grave. I'm dying laughing. It, it kills me. If you go back and you look at all of the different graves that William Brannem visited, he's mentioning places that even still today, some of these people we don't even know where their graves are.

Everybody says he's been there. I know, Confucius. So Confucius at the time. certainly did not know where Confucius was even buried back then. They have since discovered, they believe Confucius is great, but it's in like Northern China. Right? William Brown never went to China. He never got within thousands of miles of Confucius's grave. So again, made that up. So he made up the Buddha grave, he made up Confucius grave, and then Muhammad's grave.

So, Muhammad's grave is in Saudi Arabia, which so far if you've listened, William Brown never went to Saudi Arabia on this tour yet. Now, he did on the way back. On the way back, he had a layover in Riyadh, John. Oh, really? I didn't realize that. So yeah, so he did lay in in Saudi Arabia on the return trip home, but Riyadh is hundreds of miles away from Medina where the prophet Muhammad is buried. And you know, you can't get into Mecca or the prophets. They don't let non-Muslims in. You can't get into those places. So William Brown would have had to,

you know, put on a turban and pretend to be a Muslim. I mean, it's really hard to imagine how he could have pulled this off and got to go see Muhammad's grave. It's really hard to imagine that he pulled that off. From what I've read a little bit on that, there's a few very few Westerners that have been able to sneak into that place, right? Most Westerners, though, back in those days, got caught and executed, right? Like you did not, you didn't want to play around with that. The Muslim authorities would execute you for trying to sneak into those places. Yeah, and we can say with

assurance, William Brannum did not get executed. So he'd never visited. So again, just more stories. And it's just remarkable how he made up so much stuff about all of these trips that just wasn't true.

Yeah. And so probably the last thing that happened that we probably want to talk about is

what happened with Earn Baxter on this trip? If you haven't noticed, I've been bubbling over. I'm laughing at things that shouldn't be funny. We're talking about Christ Brannum. We're talking about the most heretical offensive thing that can possibly be told in this podcast. And I'm sitting here laughing because I'm waiting. I'm just chopping at the bits. We've got to talk about Earn Baxter. Yeah, right. This is an incredible story. Now, now let me preface, let me preface this, John, by saying that whenever William Brannum had a falling out with somebody, he always practiced scorched earth against them, didn't he?

Every single preacher that he ever fell out with, he would scorch earth. He would destroy them. He would mercilessly destroy them. He would root put rumors. He would whatever he could. And, in the message, maybe we didn't always recognize this, but this was true. This was true.

every single preacher that ever had a falling out with William Branham. In the message, we have all kinds of bad stories to tell about him, don't we? We tell all kinds of bad things about Oral Roberts.

We know all kinds of bad things about Gordon Lindsay. We know all kinds of bad things, but you name it. Every preach, A.A. Allen, oh man, he really had it out for Allen, the stories that they told us about A.A. Allen.

I mean, every preacher that William Branham had a falling out with, there is a mountain of ugly stories that would make you think that this person is the devil incarnate, right? Yeah. That came beyond a shadow of a doubt, came from William Branham's lips to someone's ears who then spread it out to all the people in the message.

And Earn Baxter is one of those people. Even old stories, and I'm gonna try to put my serious face on because I'm still, you know, it's such a funny story. But trying to put my serious face on, it's the opposite of Christianity, right?

You've got, if somebody doesn't believe William Branham or even just questions him, they just, the first they ostracize him, then they start the public hate speech, the campaign against their person. They can have undeniable evidence that William Branham was a fraud.

But the character assassination is so substantial that the cult in general won't listen to the person because their character has been assassinated to the extent that like the woke movement today, they'll try to dig up old things from, you know, their past and whatnot.

And if you think about it, the gospel of Jesus Christ is a gospel that saves the sinner. It's a people who have sin in their life, had sin in their life, and they became Christian and God saved them, God converted them.

Well, if you think about what they're doing, it's like they're digging up the thing that they were converted from and then spreading it everywhere. And what's interesting, we get accused of that because we're trying to portray the actual history of William Branham because we're digging up this thing that William Branham did that was very wrong.

But what we're doing is we're showing the side that the cult is not showing you that continued through until William Branham died. He continued these blatant lies. Yeah, and this pattern of behavior with William Branham is very easy to observe, right?

Like you just take the pastors of the assistant pastors of the Branham Tabernacle, right? So after George DeArch dies, a brother and McCulley becomes the assistant pastor at the Branham Tabernacle. Well, eventually he has a falling out with William Branham and he's accused of committing adultery and ran out of the Tabernacle.

Did he commit adultery? Maybe. And then his replacement, Graham Snelling, comes in, right? Graham Snelling, some time goes on and Graham Snelling has a falling out with William Branham and Graham Snelling. accused of committing adultery and ran out of the brand of tabernacle.

You see, there is a pattern, right? A pattern. Now, I, now here's the thing. I don't really believe Graham Snellen committed adultery. From everything I've looked into that, I think they made all that up.

I really do. I have spoken with Graham Snellen's family and I know the, I know the history of why they left and it had a lot more to do with, they're the ones that disconnected from brand.

I'm not vice versa. And they did because there were people who were literally starving in the church and William Brannum's going on all of these expensive hunting trips while people in his church are starving because they don't have any money.

Yeah. And so we, we see this pattern of William Brannum when people turn against him or has the following out. The, it seems like the go to accusation is they're having adultery or something along that way, right?

Some kind of a sexual sin is what it seems to be his go to accusation to eliminate people who challenge him. And you know, it's hard for me to wrap my mind around that these kind of things would be done on purpose to destroy people just to be cruel or to be vindictive.

But I really think that is what the pattern tells us if we look at it. You know, it, it's just mercilessly destroy anybody who gets in the way with whatever it takes. And I think that's what happens here with Earn Baxter.

And here's the thing too, John, on this as well. And this is where I come from, John, this is true to the present day and the message, right? The, a lot of the leaders all have a mountain of dirt on each other.

Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's like, yes. Like everybody, our church did it. Brother Jackson, Raymond Jackson did this in spades. He kept a dirt file on every other preacher. And, and we know this is true of many of the others.

And they know all kinds of stuff that they did. And guess what, so long as your friends, boy, you can just be about as dirty as you want. And we'll be good friends, right?

But the moment you look at me cross-eyed, oh boy, it's, we're gonna, we're gonna drop an atomic bomb on you. So it's, it's, it's really dirty. It's really dirty and sleazy because, you know, they, they'll, they'll look the other way.

Okay, yeah, you're an embezzler. Oh, yeah, you're beating your wife. Yeah, you're having adultery. Well, you're still our friend. You can come be our friend and we'll get along now. And, and those things by themselves are not enough to make them get rid of somebody.

But wait a minute. You preach the wicked Daniel only has three and a half years left. My God, we're gonna have to destroy you. You know, it, I don't care that you, now the whole world needs to know you beat your wife.

Right, like it, it's like that. It's ridiculous. It's, it's terrible. And I know, and I'm, are going to give names or details because it's just horrific. Not only do they keep files like this on each other, I know of ministers who are in this cult and it's very splinter groups who keep files on their members and they know exactly what's going on.

So, if they ever cross that line, we know how to assassinate their character. But even worse than that, I know of big names in William Brandham's cult, well-recognized people that everybody knows who keeps the same file on their wives and if the wife crosses a line, they're assassinated in the same way that everybody else is.

It's just unbelievable what these men do to assassinate character if you cross that line and that's not the way that a Christian behaves. What's also important to catch here is that this is one of the main things that holds the message together.

Mutual blackmail. I know. Okay, it's like Russia in the United States. They both have the nukes, right? And they know if I nuke you, we're going to destroy each other and there's a whole lot of that in the message.

I even heard a very, very famous message cult minister say that he has the same type of file on William Brandham and he said that very publicly as a threat to William Brandham sons who run the cult headquarters, I've got this file and I have this dirt on William Brandham, but he's saying it to his Brandhamite congregation.

It's something else. I specifically speak into my sect of the message. This is what I know for sure. This is what held things together for the last number of years was just the absolute dirt that people hold on each other.

You know, I'm so glad, John, that I was a perfect little message Christian that obeyed every rule. They had to fight. They had to make up some really pathetic stuff about me when I left, because there wasn't no good juicy stuff to use against me, so anyway, it's terrible though.

They will do anything they can to just try and destroy people. It really is terrible. So Charles, I'm still chomping at the bit and people can see my face. I'm bubbling over. We've got to talk about the elephant in the room.

Yeah, so well-known message story. You can find Raymond Jackson told this on tape, Lee Vales told this on tape, and these all come back from William Brandham. On this trip, apparently, Ernst Baxter was caught having relations with someone who wasn't his wife in a hotel room, right?

And this started supposedly a breakdown in relationships between William Brandham and Ernst Baxter. But of course, these things wouldn't be made public until Ernst Baxter crossed William Brandham. Yeah, and I like you, I take it with a grain of salt because of the character assassination that we've mentioned, however, Sarah Brannum's, the Sarah Brannum investigation, which you can find on our website, her attorney started digging and he found that there were other key figures that were with William Brannum who were doing similar things, one of which worked at spoken word publications, which later became a joint operation with Voice of

God recordings, the bigger cult headquarters. These same men were doing the same types of things and if it were one single instance, I would say, okay, it's character assassination, I can't believe it. But now because we have multiple, I actually have to give some credibility to the story. Yeah, I'm, I personally am completely on the fence, John. I, I think it's entirely possible, William Brannum could have totally fabricated the thing just to destroy Urn Baxter because I, I've really come to see that William Brannum is capable of those sort of things and has done those things in other cases. But then again, it's entirely possible that Urn Baxter

really was that kind of a person and William Brannum, which is equally dirty, overlooked it, you know, as long as they were buddies, right? Either way, this all reflects bad on William Brannum, right? Either he tolerated it for period of time, right? Or, or he made it up, right? Either way, William Brannum made a serious debacle here with this. Yeah. So the story is, if you believe it or not, again, I kind of lean this way, but I could be proven wrong. I'm not going to come out and say explicitly, yes, this is true, but there's some credibility, credibility to it. But apparently,

Urn Baxter was having relations with women on, on this tour. And he was so drunk that he was, he was getting off the plane and couldn't even walk straight and leave ale who is William Brannum's publicist publicly mentions this in a recording. He's ranting and railing again character assassination against all of William Brannum's inner circle. And the, the rant that he used against Urn Baxter was basically that he was a drunken womanizer, but he goes so far as to say that they knew this and that he continued to work with William Brannum as a drunken womanizer. When brother Brannum went to

India, he took with him some people. And I believe unknowing your brother Brannum was one man, I'm not sure the duplicity got him there or Urn Baxter. And I'm going to speak very plainly and I've said it before and I'm not at least alarmed to say it because it's a truth.

Backster was a womanizer. He even got drunk on the plane and came off doing the gook step and everybody laughing at him. In India he consorted with women, they came to brother Brana said, can the folk, is it right for the father to have these women? But even more alarming than that was the fact that there is a man amongst them called Count Ferry, Bon Blomberg. Bon Blomberg was the adopted son of evidently a Count and a Countess and he was recognized as a Christian evidently full gospel business in circles, but he was a homo-sexual. And he approached a

young man who was a Christian Pentecostal preacher named Siegfried Inke. I know what I'm talking about because I know Siegfried Inke met him in Columbus. He knew that I was a friend of brother Brana's and worked with him, so he amazingly told me his story how that this man did everything he could to engage him in some illicit sexual affair. William Brana's right-hand men were homosexuals, active homosexuals, right? His, the people surrounding him on his inner team were many of them were very sleazy people on, on all kinds of levels John. I mean, Jane and Leo were, Leo was a child molester for goodness sakes. I

mean, these were, this is William Brana's, you know, key team, right? And so the stuff William Brana put up with and put people into positions, you know, there's just no question that there's something seriously wrong with William Brana as a leader in his leadership style and the thing that he tolerated and put up with. And now did was our ambassador really this way or did they make it up? I'm still on the fence on that, but it would totally, it could fit either way, honestly. It's hard to say and it's such a strange thing to end our show on, but you've, look at

the facts, Charles. You've got a man who is preaching very harshly against the sins of the world, the sins of Sodom basically. So he's calling out homosexuals globally while it is proven beyond the shadow of a doubt that William Brana was traveling with well-known, well- even outspoken homosexual men. Men who they, he knew there's no way he did not know that they were homosexual. My family knew that he was homosexual while William Brana was alive. Well, they were with him.

Everybody knew this. Everybody knew this. So he's calling out the sins of homosexuality and traveling with homosexuals. He's calling against the sins of showing just a little flesh. If you showed even that much of your ankle, just two inches of your ankle, as a female in this cult, you were denounced as having a scandal skirt.

And he goes to Place Pagal where there are women with nothing on, nothing on. He's talking about the sins of homosexuality and he's saying naked men at Place Pagal. So he's doing all of these things.

He's sponsored, he's basically made his cult sponsor his vacation into Africa, Europe, different places. So in hunting safaris, hunts and kills a big game, you know, big game. And he's saying that you have to eat everything that you kill.

He's doing all of these things that he speaks against. If you stack all of this up, if you put, if you have a scale and you put a weight for every single thing that he is doing that he says not to do on these trips versus the little evidence that we have that he was actually, you know, trying to live upright during these trips, the scale is just so unbalanced that again, I have to, I have to actually ask the question, is did this actually happen?

I kind of lean that direction, but I'm not going to come out and say that earned back extra was a, a drunk and womanizer. We have opened so many cans of arms in this episode, John, we're going to have to deep dive every single one of them.

We've got a deep dive, the homosexual stuff. We've got a deep dive, just thing after thing here, we've got to get more into Roy Davis. And next episode, John, we get to his last overseas tours.

Let's just open up the last can of war. Let's just throw in the Nazis next time, all right? Okay. We're going to rip the van date off and we're just going to start talking about the most terrible things of all.

I think the next episode is probably going to be the most interesting episode that we have ever, ever done on this show. It sets up the stage for research that I'm even today, I'm only skimming the surface of it.

It runs so deep and it is so, it is like literally Charles, it is like watching a James Bond movie. We're reading about this thing and I still today, I cannot believe that this was tied to the religion of my family.

But we've got to stop here. I'm looking at the clock and we're so over, we're 30 minutes over now. So I'm going to end it and just keep in mind, next show is going to be the bomb show.

If you've enjoyed our show and you want more information, check us out on the web. You can find us at William-Brandom.org and ChristianGospelChurch.org for an overview of the historical research of William-Brandom and the healing revivals, read preacher behind the white hoods, a critical examination of William-Brandom in his message, available on Amazon, Kindle, and Audible.

Join us again next week, we've got a great episode coming. Music