Converging Apostasy: Vladimir Solovyov and the NAR

Hello and welcome to another episode of the William Brannum Historical Research Podcast. I'm your host, John Collins, the author and founder of William Brannum Historical Research at William-Brannum.org, and with me I have Steve Montgomery, the author of the converging apostasy, and a quick outline of hands-on eschatology, a matter of timing and agency.

And together we're examining the themes of apostasy in the New Apostolic Reformation and its history. Steve, it's good to be back, and I'm a little excited for today's episode. We were just talking before, we started recording how it's tying in with some of the comments we've been getting.

And I'm just, I'm dumbfounded sometimes by the things that people say and you know on the internet it kind of hides you, makes you distant from the person. Sometimes when people are talking they're saying things that they would never say if they're in front of a person's face because you get that emotional connection.

And you know if people were just to stop and think well no that might hurt that person's feelings and it's not going to do any good in the end. But you know that applies to religion, that applies to politics, that applies to pretty much everything we've been talking about.

So very glad to get into this with you. Yeah, me too, John, the recent comment that I noticed in, I thought it was interesting, it was a valid comment, but I didn't feel like I should probably get into it and answer directly.

But really I think the comment of the viewer was in relation to whether I was on the right side politically or on the left. And so this to me is an answer to that.

I located a really good, excuse me the allergies are coming up here in Texas. I found a really good article that deals with this topic, it's by Joshua Pauling. If you want to look at that later, I can send you a link to it.

But he basically says the political has ascended to become estochological. For the left, this is the only hope to usher in a better world. And then for the right, this is the last chance to prevent the world's destruction.

So I thought about that and I said that was pretty applicable to the topic. And then like always when we think in generalities or fees. Somebody that's talking about this is not directly speaking about the NAR, but I see some lairities because as in the NAR and their predecessors in the latter a movement, this sort of thing is an attempt for man to assume the role of God and redeem himself. That's the direct quote from Mr. Pauling. And Mr. Pauling also says, it attempts to replace the eschatological final judgment brought by God with utopian visions brought by humanity. And in his assessment, this is a

problem to which anyone is acceptable when ultimate importance is described to politics. Yeah, it's so interesting because I've seen the comment that you're referring to and I get those there's a reason why when I do a podcast, I will say I'm not advocating for the Democrats or the Republicans because you know, honestly, to be open and honest, I really think both parties ought to just be done away with and get some actual good people in there. I have a hard time believing this is the best that America can do. Are you serious? But what happens is if you say anything that might challenge the beliefs of one

side or the other, even if it's factual, just presenting facts, what happens is if the facts lay lay on the critical side of one side or the other, well, the other side's going to come in and say, well, you're you're taking the sides. And I I'd take neither side. I really think that both sides should be just wiped out and let's get some good people in Washington. And it happens not only with politics, but religion. As you and I were discussing right before the show, I invite anybody who has escaped a cult to come in and talk on my podcast. And you

know, it's an open door. I have let people of beliefs that, you know, I'm not going to say which ones because I don't want to hurt their feelings. But they're so far from what I believe that I sometimes I have to think it they're living a life that is deeper fantasy than the one that they left. I'll just say it like that. So I'm not an alignment with many people who get on the podcast. But anytime, for example, today, the the gentleman was talking about he had a struggle with homosexuality, which, you know, I've never had many people that I

know who have escaped these cults have had. And I feel a deep concern for them, you know, if they struggle, I would like to help them if I could. I can't. I'm not even I'm not a minister. I'm not anything like this. And so my recommendation has always been go find a pastor to help you. If you're wanting to remain Christian and you struggle with this, go find a pastor. And I just leave it at that.

But what happens is if I invite a guest on the show who has a struggle like this, then it is so polarized and politicized that you'll get people to attack that and say, well you shouldn't have invited him on your show, you must be sympathetic to the homosexuals.

Well, my dad was a pastor and one of the things that he, I really remember this phrase from him and he was talking about interpreting scripture but obviously it applies to any kind of logical discourse.

He says you can't argue from silence and I think you know what that means John but easy way to say that is, if somebody directly says something, okay, well then you can discuss it, you can think about whether there's a dialogue that can happen but if somebody has not said something, you can't inject ideas or alternate facts or whatever you want to call them into that discourse because then you have really nothing to stand on.

And so I think I neglected to bring up something that is gonna, it's gonna seem perhaps obscure to the folks that have seen these podcasts of us but I was thinking of a working title for this would be Vladimir Soloviov and the NAR.

So Soloviov, I would expect people will not be aware of them but hopefully after this broadcast, you would see a podcast where you would see how he kind of ties into things and he fits my overall premise of there's a converging apostasy coming from different angles.

One of course is Christian identity. I know there is just purely political and then of course laterane ideas and even what you'd say like new age kind of ideas from Alice Baby. So that said, this already might sound like I'm stepping on somebody's toes, but here goes.

I thought of the quest to make Russia great again. And so there's an interesting place that I found this idea coming up in and that is in the light will come from Russia by the NAR prophetess, Jim Gwynne Shaw.

Now Gwyn, if anybody has my book, you'll see that not only would she in good staying with all the NAR apostolic conferences and prophetic meetings, but she was highly influenced by esoteric thought and did some plagiarizing on her part.

But Miss Shaw tells us in this book that there will be new prophecies and she makes us all mysterious related to the role of Russia in the end times. Okay, that's interesting. You can actually hear that kind of stuff from people on the alt-right, say like Richard Spencer and even Steve Bayon into a certain extent.

Here's another fact that talks about this revitalization of Russia. The blind Russian mystic Baba Ivanga says nobody can stop Russia. And she continues saying, for the glory of Russia, Vladimir Putin will become the lord of the world.

Okay, well that's a pretty high position for a head considering kind of, yeah, he seems to be. And so one, the Russian mystic Vladimir Soliov, he would have been writing in the mid-1800s to around 1900 to the Holocaust, the nine John Landlash, probably another new name for a lot of your listeners.

And three, Alexander Dugan, here's the esoteric fascist and an advisor to Vladimir Putin. All of these people talk about ushering a new era in order to make Russia great again. Yeah, and you mentioned the ties to the NAR and I'm certain when people see that title they're going to say, what in the world is this?

But Soliov was a propagandist and as anybody who has seen the recent little short documentaries that have been putting out on the NAR, some of the things that they are spreading is propaganda. And I know that there's this big world of labeling people conspiracy theories if they talk about Russia influencing elections, especially if I mention the guy with the, you know, the big hair in the orange face, I'm not going to mention the name, but if you mention that there is a conspiracy happening, there are people who will reject that, but I'm an IT guy.

I know how AI works, I have seen the AI, I get on Facebook, I can see it. People tell me that my, sometimes they'll share one of my videos and it'll get brought down because the AI will detect that it has elements that might be seen as offensive or whatever.

And literally it's because I'm quoting these NAR guys or Brannum, which is really ironic if you think about that. They're saying these things in churches. But it's more than a conspiracy theory, it is a proven conspiracy.

I can see what's happening there in Facebook's algorithm is to try to combat what's going on with Russia and China where they're just dumping propaganda to try to sway public opinion. Well, while Russia and China are doing this with our heads in Facebook and these other social medias, they're doing the same thing in the churches with social medias, maybe not in the same way or same strategy, but it is propaganda.

And that history has been going on. If you watch the, you know, the Christian Identity series that I'm doing with John McKinnon, you can go back in the 30s and you can see the same exact thing.

happening with Hitler and back then they didn't have Facebook but it's all coming in the newspapers and they were propagandists that were spreading this thing. So the ties are unbelievable. If you, like you said, the converging apostasy will now you're converging apostasy also with propaganda and, you know, that combination to me that is the essence of the NAR.

Yeah, John, that's interesting that you mentioned being taken down off of the internet for various things, just quoting people. Back when Twitter was Twitter, that's a long time to go right, as managers and as officers, never mind. But when Twitter was still Twitter, I was quoting Bill Hammond, the supposed prophet of the NRA, sorry, NAR. And so Hammond was just saying these outlandish things about what I would call the sacred purge. And I just quoted and it was evidently considered hate speech or something else. I said, yeah, it is hate speech, but he's the one saying it, not me. So, but here's something, here's something that gets back to the Russian

aspect of things. And very interesting to me, because as in the Bible, you see wisdom is something you would ask of God if you need wisdom, ask, and your father will give you your father in heaven will give you this, because, you know, if you ask for a loaf of bread, it's not going to give you a snake. So, things like that that you might hear, and of course, I'm paraphrasing different aspects that I've heard in scripture. But here's something that you don't hear too often, is that Sophia is a personal spiritual being. Jane Lee, who so greatly influenced the latering prophets, some of them,

she referred to Sophia as the great goddess and the wonder of wonders. And she claimed that she got all over revelations from Sophia. Okay, there's a reason for that in the esoteric world. And so, let me just run down this as far as personal Sophia, other than Vladimir Solov. So, if he does think of her as a personal actual being, those who consider Sophia to be a personal spiritual being include the Nostec Valentinus, go figure. Jane Lee's mentor, the spiritualist, John Portage, Jane Lee herself. This is going to be a bit odd, sunny, but the satanic church of

Zezuzel and five, the neo-Nostec John Land Blash. So, there's another one, John Portage, probably listeners are not too familiar with him. And probably especially John Land Blash, but talk about converging, he's sort of like Wesley Swift. He's got a little bit of everything. So, here's what Mr. Lash.

as on the rise of Russia, and had to warn again this is going to get pretty weird. So he has a white supremacist, he's also a Luciferid, and he supports the rebirth of Russia.

So he's not going to be going waving, you know, the American flag. He's actually talking about Russia being the one for the end times. He says that these ideas have been revealed to him by Sophia, and get this.

He refers to Sophia as the true Lucifer, pretty odd idea there, and he says that she promotes Russia and America, left and right, working together for an alliance of white power. And so my question might be this, does this sound vaguely similar to anything said by politicians generally speaking in recent years?

So what about Sophia in the sacred purge, according to Lash? He states that the planets and its people cannot go against Sophia without an annihilation in the timeline, is what he puts it. So similar to the final solution that we all know came from the Third Reich, Lash calls this a sofic correction.

So he's kind of euphemizing the term final solution, give it a juice, all of his anti-Semitic stuff. Excuse me. And so what makes this especially dangerous is that, like the hands on eschatology of the NAR, which of course is inherited from J. Leed and lettering prophets, Lash says, that this annihilation will require human participation.

So it's not going to be angels or Jesus or an earthquake is going to swallow them up. He says, no, humans are going to have to carry that out. And he says, we have met the time of this great purging.

That's his words. Yeah, and you can go back through history and you can see every single bad regime that has risen up. And even before it was political regimes, every bad religious movement that rose up and they tie it to this esoteric knowledge.

We have the knowledge, we have the secret. You guys don't. We're the ones who have the special power. And what it is, is a tool of manipulation. And in its essence, it is a tool of propaganda, much like the gentleman we're discussing.

What's really ironic is that, while they have that type of manipulation for whatever is their premise that they're trying to put, their agenda they're trying to push, they also have manipulation on the words and phrases if it's a Christian pseudo-Christian religion, such that, for example, I've thought about this long and hard.

In the latter reign movement, they had this thing that was called discernment. Bible discernment means being able to discern. In other words, somebody comes to you and they give you this false propaganda like these movements are doing and you discern, is it true or is it false? It is discernment. Well, they're pushing this false thing in this laterane, right? So they began claiming that the word discernment actually meant the ability to detect people's personal information that they had written on their prayer cards when they came through the law. It is so absurd. Yeah. And this, you know, this got kind of widespread. And so you hear this word

kind of random we'll use even in churches that haven't been a part of that laterane history because it was so widespread, they're using this word discernment and not really clearly understanding what it is. So there's propaganda on top of the propaganda. Yeah. So, you know, more directly with this fellow, Soloviov Vladimir, his first name. He has a very long middle name, which I'm leaving out for purposes of not being pronounced very well. But he said that like a lot of our narrow folks, he claimed to be a prophet and he said that his prophecies would soon come to pass.

So he was an influential 19th century Russian philosopher who studied, go figure, lots of esoteric literature. So this included, again, the Nostek Valentinus, Kavala, which just turned up again and again and again in Esotech wrote. And he actually had access to Jane Leeds' mentors' writings and that is the spiritualist John Portage. So just as a reminder, how this is tied into things more pertinent for today, several of the laterane prophets borrowed heavily from Jane Leeds' writings and many of their ideas were then passed on to the Naur and also to what some people called the immunist ideas and so on because she talks the same and she was back there in the 17th century

writing stuff and then laterane prophets plagiarized and then passed it on to folks that preached that stuff today. And so the question here is, so what? Well, I kind of already answered that but another way to word it would be that Solovjev was in the family tradition of esoteric teachings that spawned to make things. One, they literally spawned a New Age movement. Whatever people want to call that, I would call it Alice Bailey influenced writings and she used the word New Age constantly.

So and two, the Jane Leeds inspired doctrines that developed and progressed in the laterane movement of 1948. So who does this Solovjev have in his corner? Who promotes it? Well, a lot of people do behind the scenes.

Russia and elsewhere, but here's one, John Paul II called Solovio, quote, one of the greatest Russian Christian philosophers of the 19th and 20th centuries. And bringing it all down to today, Russian President Vladimir Putin, quote, assigned his regional governors with homework. Well, who might they be? One of the ones that they gave the most homework about Putin wanted people to be familiar with the writings of Solovio. Now, there's a lot that I'm not including here, but just a quick way of saying how that might come out is that people have quoted Solovio's works and shown how they support Russian

attacks on their satellites, and in particular, the invasion of Ukraine. And studying things, we talked earlier, John, about the humanizing language. They would say that the Ukrainians are not even humans, they're beasts that have decided that they can actually rise up and challenge Mother Russia. And so their demise is fitting. Right. And the dehumanizing language really is what happens after you have the propaganda, because the propaganda is meant to manipulate your head, get you into an ideology, and then hypercharge that so that you can be aggressively against something, whereas you might not have been in the first place. And, you know,

back to the example we gave at the beginning of the show, a person who has some sort of struggle. I don't care what it is. Alcoholism in the case that I mentioned, I think it was, you know, it was almost sexuality, but there are many different sins and the array of sins that humans can do. And that's that's part of being human. You struggle with things, you know, and what one person has to struggle with the other person doesn't. Well, what happens is when you're in these movements, and they use propaganda to hyper make you hypersensitive against those things,

it's interesting because you can see what is the clearly the political agenda of the religion, because what is the current politics, what is the current sin in politics that they're focusing upon, that's the one they hypercharge you with, and that's the one that they come at you. And what happens is it dehumanizes you to the extent that the person who's struggling, you would rather attack them than to try to lift out a hand and help them back up. And it puts it into the place where your average person who has no inclination whatsoever to be a spiritual

guide to be a minister or evangelist or counselor or anything. Instead, you, you, you, the propaganda to supercharge their mind to attack and that's literally what it's doing. And so these people, they attack the person with whatever is the current popular politicized sin, right?

And it's so aggressive and the problem with this is you can look at all of the villains in history that, you know, countries that have started world wars, we're talking about Putin right now, but before him, there were several others.

They did the exact same thing and they got the people to back them in their agenda to attack other people. And so the fact that they're doing this in religion, to me, it's scary, this is some scary stuff.

Yeah, yeah. And the part about Solovio that I think is interesting and takes him out of the arena being completely obscure and therefore not really important to deal with is similar to Jane Leade.

I've had people say, well, why focus on Jane Leade? And my answer is because much of what I call hints on eschatology, I mean, we will become perfect or we will become at least morally superior to others as part of the end time.

And then really never any with Christ, well, we'll do that for Christ before a literal person Christ comes to receive the kingdom and then, of course, the sacred purge aspect of that because all of these things are being done on behalf of Christ before he returns.

So that's where Solovio actually has touched basis if you want to put it through other people in history onto the alt-right and some of the white supremacist ideas of today. And so here we go with those two supposedly obscure people but still significant.

I can say this, as far as Solovio's Sophia, that's the mouthful for me, I can say this, like Jane Leade, Solovio claimed to have mystical experiences with a personal Sophia. Not just the idea of I want to be wise, full of Sophia, now he was actually having visions, he said, and this may have been related to something, as you said, that he was struggling with because his whole life was sort of obsessed with Sophia.

And I think he either had a romantic interest or a wife of that name. So he said that Sophia was in one of these visions, he said that she was the perfect image of feminine beauty.

Now somebody, a scholar who's written about this, Dr. Oliver Smith in his The Russian Boyme, says that Solovio had deeply eroticized visions of Sophia. That is really easy to come by if you've been someone like him who studied Valentinus and Kabbalah because they're full of that kind of stuff and interestingly that kind of stuff also gets passed on to Jane Leade.

One of the only components that I've seen in Jane Leade that is not so much present in the latter reign is the feminine aspect of this divine Sophia. They pretty much stick to Jesus but they'll add in all of the other hands on eschatology kind of by this that Jane Leade did.

Okay so as far as the Nargars, this stuff is similar to what the Nar prophet Bill Johnson's when heaven invades earth says. According to Solovios, the reconciliation of Sophia, Sophia, he says that she is called the rainbow which is reconciling heaven and earth where heaven steeps down to earth in divine reconciliation.

So yeah, if you've read Bill Johnson's book, this will probably click with you and you'll say, hmm, yeah that sounds familiar. You know it's kind of funny because whenever I first left the religion and I was trying to just get footing, I mean I wouldn't even say that I was on a path yet, I was just trying to get footing and I was trying to understand what is this mess, what is this weird thing because we had the secret knowledge and so you get in Google and you type in secret knowledge and you're going to find all kinds of things that, you know, me, I didn't know existed

and it led me straight to narcissism which is the noces, the secret knowledge, right? Well, what is interesting is there, each brand of this thing, whether it's narcissism or Kabbalah or any of the others, the Sophia character exists in a certain way, certain form.

And I began to compare all of these different esoteric religions with what I had grown up with and I found out it's almost like a cookie cutter stamp religion, some of them Christianity, some of them not.

And I got to the point of right before the healing revival, it's before it became letter brain. There were numerous people that were claiming that they had some kind of secret knowledge and it came to them in different various forms which you could easily take whatever it is that they said and replace it with Sophia and it's the same exact thing.

And then, you know, about 1940s-ish, you had all of these men, not just William Brando, but many of them claiming that they had an angel come down and the angel gave them the secret knowledge and therefore, I have the new revelation and you should be my cult members.

It was so calm. Right. So many people doing it, right? Yeah. Well, and then, Brando, I don't know, I don't think he originated it, but somebody came up with the idea that angels had to not be female.

And so that began to spread through the movement, and they took the female aspect out, which is exactly what you just said It wasn't the female Sophia, but it was the same exact thing just without gender What's really interesting is when you come forward and you get into about the time of the Kansas City prophets You've got you know Paul Cain and Bob Jones and all these guys. Well, they took that same genderless angel that brand brand of claim to have he I don't think he really saw anything And they said it was a female female angel named Emma

So then they brought right the fullness of Sophia back into the to the NAR Have you ever wondered how the Pentecostal movement started or how the progression of modern Pentecostalism Transition through the latter reign Charismatic and other fringe movements into the new apostolic reformation You can learn this and more on William Branham Historical Research's website William-Branham.org On the book's page of the website You can find the compiled research of John Collins, Charles Paisley, Steven McCummery, John McKinnon and others With links to the paper, audio and digital versions of each book You can also find resources and documentation on various people and topics related to those movements

If you want to contribute to the cause you can support the podcast by clicking the contribute button at the top And as always be sure to like and subscribe to the audio or video version that you're listening to or watching On behalf of William-Branham Historical Research, we want to thank you for your support So yes, first is Angelic, Sophia You know or is it is it male or you know actually in the writings of Jane Leade She does something that goes all the way back to Valentines And kind of has like a heavier cake you need it to

She says that Sophia's genderless about what she means is Actually miraculously she says that Sophia can express herself as male or female as she wishes Well, if you're looking wicker or other places like that You see that's a very common idea And it's pretty much the the idea of the angiogenous original man You know you get in the plate toe and folks like that in definitely in and In Valentines these male female pairs in the heavenlies If one of them if one of them is cast down like Sophia was her this is pretty disgusting, but her

Her pair her consort or she was the consort apparently in his ideas of Christ And so she got kicked out of heaven for one you didn't know what it was like to be god And of course if we're reading the book of Genesis there's a lot of implications behind that So she gets kicked out.

Okay, her new role as far as the esoteric world goes is to enlighten people with the noses of their divine heritage and their divine

realignment or infusion or union with the angel that they had to lead. So, and yeah, if you get into some of the apostles of the lettering beginning like George Houghton, George Houghton was one who said,

he gave the mail gender to the body of Christ. He didn't say the bride of Christ. He said, no, we are the sons of God. And the new Jerusalem that comes down upon us, that's the feminine part.

So it gets real twisted around and it's like this, it's that like you said, the inner thing. Okay, so what about the love of Sophia and Lucifer? Okay, so here's this warning against, I think it's pretty weird.

Well, this guy, Dr. Stefan A. Holler says that Soloviov's writings were often invocations to Sophia and they were dilated, he says, with Nostican, Kabbalistic terminology and metaphors. And for example, Soloviov's song of the Ophites and maybe you know what that means, John, it was written in honor of Sophia who he referred to as the serpent of wisdom in the Garden of Eden.

Interesting. Now, if you get into the esoteric world, that's the flip side, you know, everything in the Bible gets reversed. The serpent representing Satan or Lucifer turns out to be the good guy. The guy gives illumination and freedom from the suppressive Jehovah and the Jews, all those guys who know good, so come with us.

So Valentines who were also the ones that influenced Soloviov taught that Sophia herself was the serpent. If you get into Blavatsky and some of the other occultists, you can see, yeah, yeah, that fits pretty well.

Because Blavatsky calls Valentines a saint. So you'll figure, Valentines also said that this Lucifer-like Sophia is, and this is where it gets very weird, prunecos. I think that's Latin or Greek, but yeah, it looks like Greek.

I've never heard it pronounced, but it literally means. And if you're talking about somebody who in their cult world is, you know, like Lucifer slash Sophia, a prunecos literally means quote, the sacred whore, okay?

And then some of the two genuine inspired manifest sons of God teachings, Soloviov prays to Sophia incarnate yourself. us and restore the fullness of the ages that God may be all in all. I'm glad you brought up the Garden of Eden because in the funny thing you and I tend to beat each other to topics. You beat me to it at that time. But you know, when I began doing this and I began explaining to people that a lot of what we grew up with was religious propaganda, it was hard to put that into words because people that that term propaganda has just been so

overused that people associate it with things that aren't even propaganda. But the way propaganda works in the religious form is they like to take these passages from the Bible that are very obscure, very, you know, don't have a lot of details and what happens is they will spread the propaganda to give you the details to fill in the blanks in between and that's the esoteric knowledge that would come from Sophia, right? And so what happens is the people get assimilated into these belief sets through propaganda so much so that they will take a passage that has no details,

but it's very vague, very sometimes prophetic, sometimes just literally there are no details such as the Garden of Eden. And they'll say, what's black and white? Can't you see X, Y, and Z that isn't even in the text? And the example that I was going to go to for that was, you know, William Brandham Serpent Seed, we've mentioned it, the two-seed doctrine of Christian identity, John McKinnon and I talk about it quite a bit. Well, if you talk to somebody who has been manipulated with that racist anti-Semitic propaganda, and I've had him tell me this,

can't you see it's black and white? The Serpent had sex with Eve, but there is no text that says the Serpent had sex with Eve. That's the result of propaganda. You have the propagandaists who are giving you the false information, and they're saying, fill in the blanks, can't you see, and they hypercharge you to the extent that, you know, it's kind of funny, after I escaped this thing, I look back at some of these things that we believed, and they're unimportant, you know, whether the Serpent did or didn't actually in the context of just that passage,

it's really unimportant, but we were manipulated to think that it was important, much like the propagandists. So, we were in essence, our minds were, you know, just literally hijacked by some of the propaganda, and the fruits of that, as you know, with Christian identity, turned into some very dangerous things in the 60s. Yeah, and John, you sound like you're, well excuse me today, you sound like you're kind of alluding back to this idea that I was saying my dad taught me about it's a bad idea to argue from silence. The silence there would be a full exploitation of

one of these sort of vague scriptures. It's a real problem when people try to fill in those gaps. And, tragically, I think probably the best thing is to leave him alone if you can't come up with a literal claim to see interpretation of it, then just leave it alone and don't follow what people are saying. So, one of the points in relation to that arguing from silence from vague scriptures comes with one of the big ones that all these guys were most on talk about is the manifestations of the sons of the manifestation of the sons of God. So, Saloviov actually was another

one who was really intrigued with that statement from the Bible, and he related it just like and lead to becoming, quote, perfect. So, and you see this kind of thinking in the narrative to a certain extent, especially with the older prophets, they had more access to the and influence from the latter reign. So, Saloviov was studying the eighth chapter of Romans, and that's where this phrase comes from. And he said this helped him to develop his desire for immortality and for the glory of the sons of God. Well, he could easily sound like a latering prophet, you know, even though he's just Russian mystic. And so, again, this Dr. Stefan

Holger says that all of Salovio's writings about perfection are both theostopic in therjic. So, I came across that word, you know, we read, we learn. I haven't read it too much, but I think it's easily defined as calling down spirits, even asking them to, well, calling them down for information, because they're, you know, in the heavenly, and they know more about stuff than we do, or even asking them to channel through your body, to get prophecy, or to inhabit your body, apparently, as a matter of perfection. The latter part there would fit Jane Gleed and Valentina's quite well. So, so what is this this theoregy? Well, we can go to one of the

horse's mouths here. The Satanist Helena Blavatsky of the Theosophical Society defined therjic as quote, a communication with and a means of bringing down to earth, planetary spirits and angels who are the gods of light. I mean, that sounds like it's coming straight out of Jane Gleed's mouth, especially if you've read this kind of stuff from my book, quoting Jane Gleed.

But here's where it gets a little bit interesting, or more interesting. How does this idea of calling down spirits compare with the Narprofit Bill Hammond when he calls down angels to quote a point of himself companions with Christians?

have to leave it at that. The compare is pretty well. And so here's something else that you can see. Parallels with the NAR. So you'll love you and unity. On the topic of unity, he says that there would be a global unification of the church.

And a theocracy, which would be ruled by a Russian czar, of course, think like in his day, they had Russian czar. And a universal church with a pope and the prophet. He's pretty vague about what it means by the prophet.

I don't know, folks. Read the Bible and see how that will compare the things you might hear in the book of Revelation. So speaking of Revelation, in 1900, the Lord of Rome wrote a short story of Antichrist.

And it sounds oddly similar to what the NAR prophet is. Sandy Jacob says, I mean, generally speaking. So for Saloviov, he says that genuine believers, whoever heard that lately, from Catholicism, Russian orthodoxy, and evangelical Protestantism, will all come together in unity in the 21st century.

OK, so talking about the great end time revival, of course some people would say, no, the Bible really doesn't say that. The Debillion person, harvest, and all that. There's plenty of scriptures that would have posed that and say directly opposite.

We're here to have Saloviov agreeing with the NAR prophets and saying that, yeah, all these guys are going to get together. And it's actually some direct quote from Sandy Jacob. It talks about there must be complete unity among believers.

And that's where you see some of the ideas of having this big 10th kind of philosophy of saying, OK, we're Catholic, but are you on with what we're doing? Yeah, you're non-carsomatic, maybe you're a Methodist, but hey, we need to set up the kingdom of God.

Are you with us? And so, yeah, it does sound like NAR teaching to me. But in the same story, a short story of the Antichrist, Saloviov says that there will be an imposter, OK, go figure.

And but he says that later, people that support him will become pleased with killing and silencing those who oppose this diabolical tyrant. They will even hold festivities to execute them for God. You know, and it's kind of weird and almost like a fantasy movie to the way the NAR developed over time.

I'm sure you're familiar with this, but I'm finding not everybody, even in the NAR is aware of this history. But when C. Pitt, Peter Wagner started putting a name. on what was emerging. He started claiming that there were different regions of the earth that were ruled by these elemental spirits. And so we need to establish this network and the network became the NAR. But this network of Christians who may not even believe the same things, but in the network they can provide prayer warriors to go fight the spirits. And this guy named Ted Haggard started claiming that there was this queen of heaven that he

was trying to battle with his spiritual warriors. And what was her name? It was Anna Mendez, I think it was, called a group of several people and they went up into the Himalayas to call down this elemental spirit from heaven and fight it. And you can imagine how silly that would have looked, all these people. But what they're trying to, you know, and it's all for me, it's all fantasy that none of this has even any real, any reality to it. But if it were real, what they're essentially trying to do is call down the bad spirits, not the good ones. So the

whole thing is just so absurd. It does. Yeah, John, it reminds me of one. What's a company that has the all the really popular superhero movies. Marvel. Yeah, Marvel. It sounds like one of those kind of things, doesn't it? Yeah. So, okay, here's here's something that when I mentioned this, this word, people thought, no, you really need something else. So, so you're so love you of, he had a very big influence on Russian cosmism. And people think, are you trying to say communism?

Said, no, cosmism, speaking of the cosmos. So the first question that comes up is what is cosmism? Well, from the things that I read about it, cosmism tried to synthesize gnostic beliefs with scientific progress. Okay, so, so that's a big one of those convergences.

And from anybody from Jane lead role, crime, quest, even Helena Blavowski, they all talk about these vague kind of ideas that this science and spirituality will merge and that this will somehow lead to either the new age or immortality or hiking psychic abilities, however they want to phrase it. And so, cosmism, this is kind of a dark and dirty aspect of it, I would say it seeks an alliance between Germany and Russia since both share common roots in the peoples of Aryan origin. Okay, so there you go with something that really can tie into the

guys and alt-right Christian identity. And some of the more so-called intellectuals of that movement are like Dugin, Alice and her Dugin- And they do draw upon these histories. And they're going to be in Russian.

He's familiar with Valentinus and Sophia and Plato and some of these other ideas about Cosmism. And it just goes, it's logical to show the next part here is that Cosmism shares some of lead sources of inspiration.

And remember, what she gets gets handed down to the letter ring, at least a lot of it. So for example, Cosmism includes the so-called classic occultist traditions, such as Kabbalah, astrology, alchemy, et cetera.

And like Valentinus and Jane Lee, the Cosmists, here we go. This is a big one. Theodore Vitch, theodore Rove, I think it got it, said that perfection is possible through union with immortal beings.

That probably sounds to you like Jim Jones and Brandon. To me, it sounds like also like Jane Lee. And Cosmism is saying big, happy family, even though they altered these words. As you say, John, the little levers they hold in the strings they pull for their propagandist presentations and all this stuff, they really cross ties and come together in certain respects.

I have a theory about that, which you probably wouldn't relate to too much, John. But it's totally a historical. I know you're very good with historical research. And my idea, certain forms of deception are a historical, and they just essentially follow a line to integrate Christ, to pull people away from Christianity.

But those ideas exist out there. And don't necessarily have to have so-and-so, said this to so-and-so, and whatever. So I'm sure we can have a nice discussion about that sometimes, John. OK. But here's something that does tile this Cosmist stuff back to current day narer forms.

So similar to the elitism of the narer and the Third Reich, and the Indian nationalists that we discussed last time, Cosmists believe that the transformation of man into Superman will come through authoritarianism and physical violence.

You know, you mentioned the Marvel comics, and it's hard not to apply that example to this whole thing, because you've got the Christian identity in the United States, you've got the Russian thing, you've got the Indian thing, and you know, it's- It's like the Marvel Universe, but then because of all of these networks, you've got the Marvel Universe and then you've got the DC Universe for the DC Comics and I don't know, maybe Alley Up from the funny papers. It's all of these different networks. And then within the NAR because they're tied to the bright wing pseudo-Christian, politics thing. Well, within their network,

you've got all of the different versions and variations from there, most of which aren't in full cohesion. So sometimes they'll be completely polar opposite in doctrines, but as long as they're part of the network and as long as we're joining to fight this imaginary queen of heaven or whatever is the weird thing they're fighting at the time, as long as you're part of that network, you're okay and we'll see you as a good people and anybody who opposes us as a villain. We have seated that propaganda and now, I mean, think of this, it has reached the level where even Christians in the

United States are vilified because the other Christians who are part of this network, they see the not the same flavor of Christianity as the villain because of the propaganda. Yeah, this is very unfortunate and we both see it so much. I'm really thankful for the times, I know you feel this way too, John. Other than people who maybe misunderstand what you're doing and

try to downgrade whatever your point of view is, you have these folks that are sincere, they're hurting, they've gone through some form of deception, they're trying to get out of it and they say, thank you so much, John. Thank you so much, Steve, for bringing these things to light it's helping me to get out of what I'm doing. It's helping unravel some of that stuff.

I know, John, you talked about the years that it took you to unravel and kind of get back to the just base of who you are as a person and what do you think about the Bible about Christ.

For me, when I left the positive confession where the faith group that I was in, it took a long time and even when I did go back and read the Bible, all that loaded language would come back and I think one of the terms I heard in those days was floating. So floating would be like you're kind of back in the mindset of the group and wondering, okay, well the Bible does say that, but what does it really mean? So yeah, I think what do they call that cognitive dissidents? I think that that's a big problem for people that come out of these groups and I'm

just glad that we can put in our two cents worth and help folks out. Yeah, I'm glad to.

Having gone through it, it's easier for me than some of the people who haven't, but just to put it into proper perspective. Somebody who has had their identity stolen from them. That's, that was me, that's many of the people I work with.

Well, there comes a point when you have to deconstruct that. And some of the things that people argue as sin or not sin, well, there's a point of time in your deconstruction that you really just simply don't care.

Because you have deconstructed all of that. You have nothing. You've wiped your complete. Every, every bit of your foundation is gone. And you're trying to, trying to stack back up. What is my foundation?

Who am I? What do I believe? So my parents were Christian. Why am I Christian? Why do I want to be Christian? And you have to allow that progression. Because if you try to push somebody one way or another, you may actually push them away from where you're wanting them to head.

Because you're, you're not doing the right thing. I'll just say it like that. Even the psychologists will tell you don't prophesy as people when you want to help them. Instead, show them the way, right?

So that's what we try to do here. Everybody's welcome and I'm glad we can talk through these things. And it's just, for me, it gets more and more fascinating. The further you and I go into the converging apostasy.

Because every single aspect of what we talk about on this show, my mind is racing through all of these doctrines and how it applies. And I know that all of our listeners are the same way.

That's why this, this is one of the more popular ones that I do. So thank you so much for doing this with me, Steve. Glad to be a part of it, John. Well, if you've enjoyed our show and you want more information, you can check us out on the web.

You can find us at William-Branum.org. For more information about the dark side of Laterane, you can read Weaponized Religion from Laterane to Colonia Dignidad, available on Amazon, Kindle, and Audible. For more about the converging apostasy, you can read the book, The Converging Apostasy.

And you can also read the book, A Quick Outline of Hands on Eschatology, A Matter of Timing and Agency.

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